lying - thoughts on the matter

If it is shown on my hand that I am a liar and I am aware of this. If I work on always being truthful am I still a liar just a repressed one or am I truthful?

I am actively trying to work on always being truthful, which is hard because I am naturally a liar. Is it better to come clean on previous lies or is it better to start on a new foot and know that within yourself you are telling the truth. I can't wrap my head around the repercussions of these actions but choose to no longer lie (within my power sometimes we subconsciously lie to ourselves - and I make exceptions to things I am not aware of ).
Any thoughts on this matter would be appreciated!

I'm not referring to myself in regards to this site. This is just something that I'm pondering.

zeblethai wrote:I'm not referring to myself in regards to this site. This is just something that I'm pondering.

Thanks Zeblethai for the laugh - I had read your first post earlier and wondered, well then does that mean she hasn't been fully honest with us.

Where do you see 'dishonesty' in the palms?

I would look for things like integrity, values, principals and the quality of the little finger.

zeblethai wrote:I'm not referring to myself in regards to this site. This is just something that I'm pondering.

Are you lying?

Patti said..Where do you see 'dishonesty' in the palms?

I would look for things like integrity, values, principals and the quality of the little finger.

I meant to say the little finger not the palm. I have no idea where one would see dishonesty in the palm of the hand. Maybe an over developed mount of Mercury with unfavorable markings on it, but I wouldn't necessarily attribute these markings to dishonesty.

Hok, hahahaha wait, am I lying????? Or am I simply ignorant. WAIT, I'm ignorant and my lying.

Hi,
I think that if a person decides to be truthful, and means it, they will be so, but their personality will still have the inner drive to say what they think others want to hear. So they may not think they are lying, but simply trying to please others (and still have their white lies). Often having religious background or having faith helps the person to become a better person. If the signs on their hand show the signs, it is likely that they will always lie about something, or maybe not be open, just keep secrets and not say anything.

Sari said..I think that if a person decides to be truthful, and means it, they will be so, but their personality will still have the inner drive to say what they think others want to hear. So they may not think they are lying, but simply trying to please others (and still have their white lies). Often having religious background or having faith helps the person to become a better person. If the signs on their hand show the signs, it is likely that they will always lie about something, or maybe not be open, just keep secrets and not say anything.

Most people do this though. We generally don't tell our boss that we spent Friday night drinking beer and complaining about them because most people are fixated on immobility and quantifying others. Quantifying others is fine, we all do it especially palm readers. It's when we become angry when something (or someone) changes because we are forced to reevaluate the person or situation. The whole problem with this is that the world isn't stagnant, it's always changing even if we aren't. Maybe the whole concept of lying and disillusionment is faulty and based on principles that the earth doesn't follow. If the earth is constantly changing and we're not aware of it, the universe is not lying to us we're simply unaware or ignorant. The solution would be to be constantly changing ourselves to lessen our ignorance and prevent ourselves from lying. Maybe this is why people lie, it's too much work not to. hahaha

In Richard Dawkins, The Selfish Gene, Dawkins talks about a lecture on the notion of an animal telling a lie, for example..
"if a bird uses the 'there is a hawk' signal when there is no hawk, thereby frightening his colleagues away, leaving him to eat all their food, we might say he had told a lie.We would not mean that he had deliberately intended consciously to deceive.. Whenever a system of communication evolves, there is always the danger that some will exploit the system for their own ends. He goes on to say that all animal communication contains an element of deception, because all animal interaction involves some conflict of interest.

This idea brings me back towards the universe and the fact that it is always vibrating and changing as is everything else, except our minds.

zeblethai wrote:In Richard Dawkins, The Selfish Gene, Dawkins talks about a lecture on the notion of an animal telling a lie, for example..
"if a bird uses the 'there is a hawk' signal when there is no hawk, thereby frightening his colleagues away, leaving him to eat all their food, we might say he had told a lie.We would not mean that he had deliberately intended consciously to deceive.. Whenever a system of communication evolves, there is always the danger that some will exploit the system for their own ends. He goes on to say that all animal communication contains an element of deception, because all animal interaction involves some conflict of interest.

This idea brings me back towards the universe and the fact that it is always vibrating and changing as is everything else, except our minds.

I think if an animal uses a method or signal as a 'tool' to get food then the deception is conscious and deliberate. Thinking of deception and evolution, think about the moth that has the appearance of an eye on each wing giving an illusion of being a large animal.

Do you really think that our minds are not vibrating and changing? I think that thought itself is vibration and we all have unique patterns and waves of vibration that we express. This expression is what we read in our hands.

We basically know what feels good and what feels bad to ourselves, and our level of confidence in the moment and circumstance can push us to say or do what makes us feel the least badness even if it's knowingly telling a lie.

Patti said..Do you really think that our minds are not vibrating and changing? I think that thought itself is vibration and we all have unique patterns and waves of vibration that we express. This expression is what we read in our hands.

We basically know what feels good and what feels bad to ourselves, and our level of confidence in the moment and circumstance can push us to say or do what makes us feel the least badness even if it's knowingly telling a lie.

Good point Patti, I do believe that our minds are always vibrating and changing. It seems futile to hold on to beliefs and prejudges for so long even our body resits it (I have lots of theory's on that but no real prof) . People still seem to evolve even if they don't want to.
Quite often it is circumstantial when we lie. I think not harming people in anyway is more important then whether or not someone is lying. If we try to be as honest as possible, I'm certain that it will pay off for ME in the long run (I can't speak for anyone else).

I think the best honesty is being honest with yourself and your feelings.

I think the best honesty is being honest with yourself and your feelings.

I agree Sari!

Patti said...I think if an animal uses a method or signal as a 'tool' to get food then the deception is conscious and deliberate. Thinking of deception and evolution, think about the moth that has the appearance of an eye on each wing giving an illusion of being a large animal.

Patti, I forgot to mention, In Richard Dawkins book his next example of deception is the moth that you mentioned. Have you read the Selfish Gene?

zeblethai wrote:

I think the best honesty is being honest with yourself and your feelings.

I agree Sari!

Patti said...I think if an animal uses a method or signal as a 'tool' to get food then the deception is conscious and deliberate. Thinking of deception and evolution, think about the moth that has the appearance of an eye on each wing giving an illusion of being a large animal.

Patti, I forgot to mention, In Richard Dawkins book his next example of deception is the moth that you mentioned. Have you read the Selfish Gene?

Hi Sari and Zeblethai,
Yes - how often we use the phrase that 'one is in denial'!

The name Richard Dawkins is very familiar, but I haven't read Selfish Gene. Title makes it sound interesting.

What did he say about evolution developing deliberate deceptions? I would think it falls back on survival. To have dinner and not be dinner. Our brains really only know our own self and everything else is viewed through the filter of our emotions.

Personally, I don't think outright dishonesty or lying is really shown as such in the hands except in gesture. Instead I think we should look for qualities such as openness, vulnerability, control, integrity, straight forwardness and bluntness or the lack thereof. I view bent little fingers as not so much white lies, fibs and storytelling - but more about childhood issues that led the person to feel uncomfortable and insecure in being direct, open or up front about things. This in combination with other features can indicate dishonesty but is not in and of itself a mark of a liar.

zeblethai wrote:
It seems futile to hold on to beliefs and prejudges for so long even our body resits it (I have lots of theory's on that but no real prof) . People still seem to evolve even if they don't want to.

Your description is a description of dis-ease. Conditions that appear in the hands like dyshidrosis, arthritis and eczema are often caused or exacerbated by stress. This holding on to 'habitual thinking' even when our body is resisting leads to dis-ease.

Patti said.. Your description is a description of dis-ease. Conditions that appear in the hands like dyshidrosis, arthritis and eczema are often caused or exacerbated by stress. This holding on to 'habitual thinking' even when our body is resisting leads to dis-ease.

I completely believe this but have no prof for my beliefs.
I recently went on a cleanse to see if my body had any allergies to certain foods. I stopped eating bread, cow's milk products, and refined food, my body broke out in eczema, which I hadn't had previously but my skin cleared up and I found that some of my moodiness completely went away. Bread and milk products caused me to experience anxiety (I know this because I cheated and anxiety was the result). Now, I have actively worked on meditating and yoga, reiki etc.. everyday (not reiki that would be draining - and I taught myself so I don't know if I'm doing it properly but It feels like I know what I'm doing) so I think my body was waiting to get rid of all these toxins and when I went on the cleanse it took teh opportunity to clean me out. Back to the topic being truthful to yourself is recognizing your aches and pains and using this knowledge to help heal ourselves. Fast Food may give us pleasure at the time but in the end it makes us feel terrible and has repercussions on our body that by not being truthful with ourself we'll end up with clogged arteries etc...

Perhaps we should be studying this man's hands in regards to honesty


Deceit of Shakespearean Proportions
"The deceit of Dick Cheney is indeed of Shakespearean proportions, as evidenced in his new memoir. For the former vice president, lying comes so easily that one must assume he takes the pursuit of truth to be nothing more than a reckless indulgence."