gypsies present day readings

**jeanette** Wed Nov 23, 2011 10:41 pm

I watched a programme about Romanian Gypsies and they said they originally came from India. What I am thinking is, not knowing about fingerprints, they would have read palms only. So present day do they and other gypsies, (I don't know how to differentiate them) now incorporate fingerprints in their readings. Say if you went to a gypsy for a reading today would they look at fingerprints.
Thanks,
Jeanette.
P.S. They also said on the programme that Cheiro's mother was Irish and his father was a Romanian gypsy and that the gypsies offered Cheiro the ring to be King of the Gypsies but he passed it on.

**Martijn (admin)** Wed Nov 23, 2011 11:42 pm

jeanette wrote:...Say if you went to a gypsy for a reading today would they look at fingerprints.

Hi Jeanette,

Gypsies usually practice 'old hand reading' - which is typically focussed on making future predictions. Fingerprints usually hardly play a role in that purpose.

PS. I prefer to say that contrary to 'old hand reading', 'modern hand reading' is not focussed on making 'predictions', instead 'modern hand reading' is focussed on various types of ASSESSMENT - including: health, personality & life purpose, etc.

**jeanette** Thu Nov 24, 2011 12:08 am

Thanks Martijin,
However, I am surprised at the success they claim. I have just read a book by Eva Petulengro, think that is the right spelling of the surname,and she is a Romanian Gypsy. I thoroughly enjoyed the book, but kept wondering if fingerprints played a part. However, you have explained the difference and thanks again.
Jeanette.

**Martijn (admin)** Thu Nov 24, 2011 12:18 am

jeanette wrote:Thanks Martijin,
However, I am surprised at the success they claim. I have just read a book by Eva Petulengro, think that is the right spelling of the surname,and she is a Romanian Gypsy. I thoroughly enjoyed the book, but kept wondering if fingerprints played a part. However, you have explained the difference and thanks again.
Jeanette.

Jeanette, claiming success is one thing... but presenting evidence of success is a different thing.

(Please be aware: people tend to make firm claims just to sell their business)

**jeanette** Thu Nov 24, 2011 10:50 am

Thanks.

**Felicity Martin** Sat Feb 11, 2012 10:44 pm

Martijn (admin) wrote:
jeanette wrote:Thanks Martijin,
However, I am surprised at the success they claim. I have just read a book by Eva Petulengro, think that is the right spelling of the surname,and she is a Romanian Gypsy. I thoroughly enjoyed the book, but kept wondering if fingerprints played a part. However, you have explained the difference and thanks again.
Jeanette.

Jeanette, claiming success is one thing... but presenting evidence of success is a different thing.

(Please be aware: people tend to make firm claims just to sell their business)

I agree with Martijn and actually believe it is unethical to 'predict' people's future. I have time and time again seen the damaging consequences of this based on people's trust in what has been said, including one elderly lady who had wasted a huge part of her life waiting to win a large amount of money. She was from the Russia during the time of Stalin, and a gypsy had told her she would win lots of money. In my interpretation, as she sat in comparative luxury, very well dressed with her equally well to do daughters, I explained there was a dramatic difference to her time in Russia and that the gypsy, who probably 'saw' this had assumed she had won money... so in many ways, she had not fully enjoyed her lifestyle change, believing an even better set of circumstances was around the corner.

It takes discipline as many 'ask for their future' and it is important, that hands, and also the Tarot indicate potentials only. The tarot, for me acting much like Thematic Apperception Tests, where, as they represent so many archetypal symbols, which can trigger buried memories, or are so open to story telling and ambiguity in interpretation, often allow someone to discuss deeply entrenched attitudes or current circumstances with someone who is able, assuming they are not exploiting the interpretation for their own egoist desires, to offer alternative perspectives which may be difficult when emotionally involved in a stressful situation.

Lovely question and will check out the book!
Felicity

**Ramann** Sun Feb 12, 2012 4:39 pm

Martijn (admin) wrote:
jeanette wrote:Thanks Martijin,
However, I am surprised at the success they claim. I have just read a book by Eva Petulengro, think that is the right spelling of the surname,and she is a Romanian Gypsy. I thoroughly enjoyed the book, but kept wondering if fingerprints played a part. However, you have explained the difference and thanks again.
Jeanette.

Jeanette, claiming success is one thing... but presenting evidence of success is a different thing.

(Please be aware: people tend to make firm claims just to sell their business)

Hello Martijn,

Refer post and reply for claiming success.Indian palmistry is predictive but has still not reached the status of making a business like what one may find in Europe or US.

This may be offbeat in relation to gypsies but since Jeanatte mentioned that Gypsies have come form India I am trying to relate to only the predictive aspects/claiming success and the idea of business proposition.

Another reason palmistry is still not is a good business venture in India is because vedic astrology overshadows palmistry.

Also for claiming success is concerned I have personally known some palmists in India who have predicted accurately years in advance to somthing that western system can not even think of.And some of these palmists are plain clothed man with palmisty as a hobby contrary to what you may think them of one having sandal wood pasted on their foreheads.

Most of them do not charge .And even if they do its very minimal.Some less than 1$ and some may be a bit more..I am here not endorsing any method but personally I find Indian palmistry more challenging.

So contrary to what you are saying does not hold good always.And not to forget that India is a large country with different schools of astrology and palmistry within.So may be the view you have of palmisty in one part of India may not be of the other part.

Would like to know what you opine for.

Best Regards and Thanks!

Raman

**Ramann** Sun Feb 12, 2012 5:05 pm

Felicity Martin wrote:
Martijn (admin) wrote:
jeanette wrote:Thanks Martijin,
However, I am surprised at the success they claim. I have just read a book by Eva Petulengro, think that is the right spelling of the surname,and she is a Romanian Gypsy. I thoroughly enjoyed the book, but kept wondering if fingerprints played a part. However, you have explained the difference and thanks again.
Jeanette.

Jeanette, claiming success is one thing... but presenting evidence of success is a different thing.

(Please be aware: people tend to make firm claims just to sell their business)

I agree with Martijn and actually believe it is unethical to 'predict' people's future. I have time and time again seen the damaging consequences of this based on people's trust in what has been said,Felicity

Hello Felicity,

Please refer your post.I partially agree to what you have said.Ethical or unethical I can not comment but it is absolutely unwise for the palmist to tell anything fabulous or disastrous.
And strangely some of these palmists's predictive readings do come true.Since predictive aspects of palmistry is very prevalent in India I have seen more of the bad effects than the good.

My aunt now in her late fifties had her hands read when she was in her thirties.Many things that were told came true.However one thing that she feared most was a dreaded accident and probable death at 49-50 that was predicted.Nothing of that sort happened and she is still in fine health.Seeing my interest in Palmistry she confided me the incident and the horror she had to go through as years passed by till that ill fated years predicted.

This type of reading is almost followed even today.So I think even if someone is trained to do the predictive aspects should use his or her words and advice judiciously to avoid having long term damages to the subject.

I appreciate your post Thumbs up!

and concern again.

Thanks.

Raman

**Martijn (admin)** Sun Feb 12, 2012 5:15 pm

Sorry Ramann, I think your post sort of goes beyond the issue(s) Jeanette adressed (= Gypsy palm reading).

By the way... where I used the word 'business', you should read that as a synonym for just 'making a living'. Maybe you misunderstood my point: I was only trying to point out that one should not be naive about people's claims - especially when they try to make a living with these claims & related anecdotal stories.

wave

**Ramann** Sun Feb 12, 2012 5:24 pm

Martijn (admin) wrote:
Sorry Ramann, I think your post sort of goes beyond the issue(s) Jeanette adressed (= Gypsy palm reading).

By the way... where I used the word 'business', you should read that as a synonym for just 'making a living'. Maybe you misunderstood my point: I was only trying to point out that one should not be naive about people's claims - especially when they try to make a living with these claims & related anecdotal stories.

Yes Martijn, my post goes sort of beyond the topic and I have even mentioned that in my post.Para second.

I was only relating to what is prevalent in India where Palmistry is still not serious business.I do not know about European Gypsies and so can not comment.

And for the naivety is concenred I have put a personal anecdote in my following post of the harms of predictive aspects.

Warm Regards

Raman

**Lynn** Sun Feb 12, 2012 6:57 pm

Jeanette, regarding Eva Petulengro's book. Eva Petulengro used to do readings at a shop near me on Torquay harbourside, with her daughter Claire.
by the way it is Romany or Romani gypsy, rather than Romanian.
I think Manfred shared this video before (maybe on facebook)

**jeanette** Sun Feb 12, 2012 10:08 pm

Thanks Lynn, that was good I hadn't seen it. I thought romany and romani meant the people came from Romania. However, my original question has been answered and they do not use fingerprints. I think you will probably know about all the programmes we are getting on television about gypsies. Well I watch them all. The gypsies are from all different countries and most of them still don't read or write, so that explains a lot.
Jeanette.

**Felicity Martin** Mon Feb 13, 2012 6:24 am

Thanks Lynne, a wonderful resource for classes. Felicity

**zaobhand** Fri Mar 16, 2012 2:19 pm

Thanks Lynn for the video link, very interesting, though I would have loved to see more about her methods or how she sees into the future. Anyone read her book? http://www.amazon.co.uk/Girl-Painted-Caravan-ebook/dp/B004LROOZ0

**jeanette** Fri Mar 16, 2012 3:32 pm

Hi Zoab,
I read the book and thoroughly enjoyed it. It is about the gypsy way of life and so interesting. I have read four books recently, gypsies writing their life stories, hoping to read about their methods of palm reading, but there is not much detail of that in them. One I read said that they left small markings, that only other gypsies would understand, on the walls of houses they had read palms in and it would give the next traveller a good start with their readings, eg they had a sign that meant this lady is a widow, this lady has lost a child etc. etc.
Pity you did not live nearer me, for I would give this and the other books.
Jeanette.

**zaobhand** Fri Mar 16, 2012 4:18 pm

Hi Jeanette,

Thanks for your feedback. I also find the life of gypsies fascinating and enjoyed seeing movies about them such as by Tony Gatlif. That's funny how they leave tips for their fellow palm readers. Now I have an excuse to visit Scotland Smile

**jeanette** Fri Mar 16, 2012 6:46 pm

I have never heard of Tony Gatlif, so will look out for his work. Thanks Zoab.
Jeanette.

Roosi Fri Mar 16, 2012 10:15 pm

Hi Lynn

Thanks for sharing this video

I noticed that Eva little finger is very long Surprised

**jeanette** Fri Mar 16, 2012 11:30 pm

Hi Roosi,
I didn't notice that and it certainly is.
Jeanette.

**Lynn** Sat Mar 17, 2012 2:02 am

hi Roosi - like Jeanette I didn't notice Eva's little finger, but it sure appears long in that picture! thanks.

Zoab, I hadn't heard of Tony Gatlif before either, but like Jeanette I will search about him.

Jeanette, I also found it interesting how they left tips for their fellow palm readers. Seems Zoab and I both want to visit Scotland, so....put the kettle on! ;-)

My great-great grandfather was a travelling showman with a ghost show on the fairgrounds. They travelled round in a "living waggon". Whilst various members of my family worked at various fairground attractions, I have no evidence that any of them gave palmistry readings Wink

They weren't Romanies.

**zaobhand** Sat Mar 17, 2012 3:20 am

Hi Lynn,

You have an interesting ancestry. My somewhat non-orthodox streak is pretty much in contrast with my family. Came here for a lesson in being practical.. jocolor

Two movies of Gatliff that I've seen and recommend are Latcho Drom and Gadjo Dilo. http://blogcritics.org/video/article/gypsy-zeitgeist-films-by-tony-gatlif/
Another good movie is "Time of the gypsies" http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0097223/

There is some pain/sadness in this kind of life, depicted in the movies. Eva Petulengro's seems to have had relatively good experiences. I am also reminded of Victor Hugo's "The man who laughed" of the cruelty that can take place in the name of making money out of nomadic/underground show-business.

**jeanette** Sat Mar 17, 2012 3:31 pm

Hi Lynn,
I read your post before you edited it and it is great. What a story. I don't think I would find anything like that. What I have read is show people are not gypsies. I think they could be described as travelling entertainers. Good idea for you and Zaob to come to Scotland. You can both stay with me and while you are out looking for your ancestors Zoab could go out looking for markings on house walls. I will make a dinner for you both coming back.
Zaob I looked up Tony Gadlif and the dvds of his films are very expensive and I don't know if they would be in english. They sound good films though..
Jeanette.

**zaobhand** Sat Mar 17, 2012 3:38 pm

Hi Jeanette, That's a deal and I'll look for signs. I may have a talent for finding lost/hidden things. When small my mother would call each time an item was lost. Even up to this day, it doesn't even have to be me, just being there, my mom finds it. Some time ago a coworker was bit upset as she couldn't find her eyeglasses for a week or so. I told her to look under her bed and there it was... It is possible to view many films online for free, the quality isn't as good, just type file name + free + online and follow the links, of course be careful of malaware. There is also file sharing but that really isn't legal. I think it should also be possible to pay for some site (like netflix of amazon) to get the movie streamed to your computer. Not sure how it works in Scotland.

**jeanette** Sat Mar 17, 2012 3:56 pm

Thanks Zaob,
I don't know much about computers, so I will wait until my family visit and tell them.
You certainly sound handy to have around. Pity you weren't here, as I am hunting for a Churchill coin bought in 1965 and can't find it.
Jeanette.

**zaobhand** Sat Mar 17, 2012 4:02 pm

Jeanatte, My 'talent' may work only with my mom, and perhaps few more anecdotes, but just for the fun of it, I'm seeing cracks perhaps on the floor or wall. Not sure if this helps.

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